When the ball is dead?

Samba · 16-03-2002, 05:46 PM

When the ball is dead and what does that exatly mean
(ie. how does it affect the game)?

Is it true that when the ball is dead, there is no attacking or defending team?

-Samba

Raymond Liow · 17-03-2002, 09:45 AM

When a ball is dead, it means that all play has ceased.

When a timekeeper's signal blows to indicate end of half/game, the ball is dead. This means even if the ball was on its way into the goal but crossed the goal plane AFTER the signal blew, there's no goal.

Samba · 17-03-2002, 01:00 PM

Is the ball dead anytime else than in the end of every perioid,
for example when there's a timeout?

-Samba

Raymond Liow · 17-03-2002, 02:29 PM

A ball is dead at the timekeeper's signal at the end of every half. Though it is not written in the rules, the ball is 'dead' when the referee or timekeeper sounds a signal resulting in a stop in the clock.

Hope that answers your question, Samba.

Samba · 17-03-2002, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Though it is not written in the rules, the ball is 'dead' when the referee or timekeeper sounds a signal resulting in a stop in the clock.

Does that mean that in the case of timeout, there is no attacing nor defending team?
Because, if there isn't defending team there is also no goalkeeper!

-Samba

Raymond Liow · 17-03-2002, 02:43 PM

I don't understand. Why do you need to know who's attacking or defending when the clock has stopped?

Samba · 17-03-2002, 02:47 PM

Because, if there isn't defending team, there can't be no goalkeeper and there for there can't be no illegel tackle against the goalkeeper...

Unfortunatly, I think I'm right here...

-Samba

Raymond Liow · 17-03-2002, 03:07 PM

When the ball is dead, it does not matter if there is illegal tackle on goalkeeper or not. There is no goal even if the ball was on its way to an open goalmouth before it crosses the goal plane.

Samba · 17-03-2002, 03:19 PM

Sorry, maybe I wasn't clear enough...

What I meant was...
When the time is out in middle of period, for example something happens and the time is out, now at this moment, when the time is out, is there defending team?
If there isn't defending team, I can go and push the goalie and
nobody cant say a thing, because there is no goalie if the team isn't defending team...

-Samba

Raymond Liow · 17-03-2002, 03:43 PM

You are right in this instance.

A player can do anything he wants, as long as it's not dangerous, when the ball is dead. However, once the ball is about to be back in play, he cannot interfere with the keeper.

As a referee, you can use your own discretion to determine if the player's actions are valid or not. It does not necessarily mean you cannot sanction a player if the clock is stopped.

conor · 17-03-2002, 11:05 PM

If a time out has been called, the players should not be fighting for position / or making tackles. Onlu when a decision has been made and indicated by the refeereand when the whistle has been blown should normal play resume.

As Raymond says, the ref has descression if he wants to sanction a player during a tiemout if he feels it necessary.

clyde · 20-03-2002, 01:41 PM

I am a player 1st and and a referee 2nd.
I am also a practical person.

In practice in your "dead ball" situation (T-Out) both teams will compete for position.

This happens ! And it's ok !

However, all the players must be aware that they are still playing to the rules.
For example, players are not allowed (just because there is a T-Out) to make illegal kayak tackles. Like wise, they are not allowed to hit each other with their paddles etc.

You say there is no GK, that may be true, but you can not stop a player trying to take up position of GK. This would be either Illegal Screen or Illegal Kayak Tackle - depending upon what and where you are doing.

During this T-Out, you can still be penalised and issued cards if needed. Also, if the ball was being retrieved on your side line and your team mate committed a foul on the opposing player trying to take up position under their goal, then your team mate would lose possession for your team as he committed a foul.

But this all means the referee is paying attention !

There you go - simple.
You know the rules - play to them all the time and don't rely on the referees and the game will be a lot better !!!

21-03-2002, 06:40 PM

Clyde said:
"In practice in your "dead ball" situation (T-Out) both teams will compete for position. This happens ! And it's ok ! However, all the players must be aware that they are still playing to the rules. For example, players are not allowed (just because there is a T-Out) to make illegal kayak tackles. Like wise, they are not allowed to hit each other with their paddles etc. You say there is no GK, that may be true, but you can not stop a player trying to take up position of GK. This would be either Illegal Screen or Illegal Kayak Tackle - depending upon what and where you are doing."
End of Clyde Quote

So does what you said there also hold true during periods where the ball is "out of play" (as opposed to a time out). For instance if a shot on goal is blocked out of bounds and an attacker runs into the goalkeeper? Presumably since the attacking team is still in posession of the ball (though it is out of the field of play), the collision with the GK would still be an illegal kayak tackle?

This seems to happen fairly regularly - and I'm sure there's a rule somewhere about this, but I can't find it.

vish · 21-03-2002, 06:54 PM

From my perspective, possession only occurs when the ball is live, or when it is available for your team to take a restart.

I reckon, if the tackle knocked the goal keeper and the corner was about to be taken, then I would call against the attacking team, after all, then it is in their posession. If however, the ball was being recovered for a throw I might Time Out and then warn the offending player- either with illegal kayak tackle or unsportsmanlike behaviour. I would then allow the goalie to position themselves before restarting time.

Tom · 22-03-2002, 12:14 PM

"So does what you said there also hold true during periods where the ball is "out of play" (as opposed to a time out). "

Yes, an infringement does not have to take place when the ball is in play. An infringement can be called for an offence when the ball is in play or gone out for sideline, goal-line, corner, free shot or time out. Once the players are on the water and an infringement occurs then an infringement can be called.

I have seen players been given official warnings for events when the game had just finished for their actions on the water